User talk:John

You have been granted admin/'crat on BotWiki
Hi John, as per my original request, I have now granted you Administrator and Bureaucrat rights on BotWiki. I hope that the BotWiki will eventually become "the place to be" for anything to do with running bots on Orain wikis, whether on a local wiki or globally. Augur NZ &#x2710; &#x2315; 01:01, 29 August 2013 (UTC)

Opted-out of global bot wikis
Hi John, I just saw this new WikiSet and I'd like to make use of it. I already know how to respect the  and the   imperatives, as Pywikipediabot is exclusion compliant "out of the box". I was wondering how I can integrate this new WikiSet you have created, in order to automatically respect the wishes of those admins who have requested to opt out of global bots using this WikiSet? I can do it manually, I guess, by checking the WikiSet before each bot run to ensure that there have been no changes to the membership list of wiki's that have opted out, but I'd like to have a more automated method if possible. Any ideas? Augur NZ &#x2710; &#x2315; 05:49, 4 September 2013 (UTC)
 * To my knowledge there is a way. The best thing as far as I know is using the API call which lists and displays on the requested wikiset. I constructed the API call you need to use here John (talk) 06:06, 4 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Thanks John, but that just went straight over my head ;) While you and Addshore may be creating bot frameworks that leverage the MediaWiki API, I'm still stumbling around here learning how to use an established framework, as an end-user. At present my level of knowledge is limited to "use this script with these parameters to achieve this result". I haven't really even encountered WikiSets before I joined Orain, so I have no idea about them either. I understand if it would take you too long to explain in layman's terms. Feel free to just tell me to RTFM or ask on #pywikipediabot on FreeNode IRC. I guess at least I know my own limitations, hehe. Augur NZ &#x2710; &#x2315; 06:38, 4 September 2013 (UTC)
 * I'd suggest what you said :p Also it is Addshore doing the bot work, I just there and throw demo scripts together on request. John (talk) 06:45, 4 September 2013 (UTC)

Some items relating to extensions you may want to share/discuss with the rest of the Orain staff
In the event certain extensions are requested by other users or are implemented globally, I would like to share some information that would be of use to yourself and the rest of the Orain staff.


 * MediaWiki Language Extension Bundle - In the event any of the extensions included in this extension package are requested, I extremely recommend only the latest version of the extensions be installed from this downloadable bundle. This reason is since these extension are intensely interrelated and can easily go awry if they are unstable, and several interface errors can occur with bleeding edge version of these extensions. I recently requested most of the extensions included in this bundle for my wiki explicitly from this bundle alone for stability reasons, and I recommend that either this entire bundle's latest version (or certain extensions from the bundle) be installed if they are requested by anyone else.


 * Semantic Bundle - For similar reasons as the above, if SMW extensions are requested, I recommend they be installed from this bundle and all updates should follow the bundle update path. Any SMW extensions not part of this bundle I cannot speak for. Arcane (talk) 20:17, 10 September 2013 (UTC)Arcane

SACwiki requests at Dusti's talk page
Hello, John. Dusti is away, and he suggested that such requests be addressed to you and other stewards. Could you please take a look at his talk page? There are three recent requests at the bottom of the section. It's kind of time sensitive and I'd really appreciate if you could help me out. Or shall I copy the requests here? Many thanks. SAC SEC (talk) 06:30, 12 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Done 1 (pending), not sure about 2 and I have done 3. John (talk) 06:40, 12 September 2013 (UTC)
 * WOW! That was fast! Thank you very much, John. Regarding 2, when I make any edit to this section (BTW, how do you create wikilinks to other wikis such as SAC on meta.orain.org?) and save, the screen goes blank even after repeated refreshing, so I have to open the entire page to be able to read the section. However, the changes are always saved. This happens only with this particular section. I wonder if you can reproduce the glitch. Regards, SAC SEC (talk) 06:51, 12 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Update – now users SAC01, SAC02, and SAC03 cannot edit because their accounts "are not unified". Is there a fix for this? Regards, SAC SEC (talk) 06:51, 13 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Hm. Ask them to visit Special:MergeAccount. John (talk) 14:24, 13 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Just did. SAC01 appears to be all right, but SAC02 and SAC03 are unable to log in. Do you reckon it will be easier to block these two accounts and create new ones? Regards, SAC SEC (talk) 19:06, 13 September 2013 (UTC
 * What ever you want to do really. Might be easier. John (talk) 19:08, 13 September 2013 (UTC)
 * So I'll do that then. And thanks for enabling file upload option -- it's up and running now. Regards, SAC SEC (talk) 19:51, 13 September 2013 (UTC)

Request Features
I have requested some features for patereswiki some days before... maybe you can tell me when these extensions will be installed???

Thank you (evagelosvar)

TropicalWikis Merge
Hi John,

It's Spydar007 from TropicalWikis. Do you know when our accounts and wikis will be moved over to Orain?

-Spydar007
 * I do not know a specific date yet. John (talk) 18:16, 11 October 2013 (UTC)

GammaWiki creation request
Hello John. Could you please take at look at my GammaWiki creation request at your earliest convenience? Thanks. - ABloom (talk) 07:29, 11 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Thank you John for creating Gammawiki. Could you please make it private and inaccessible for anybody else except its members, and to grant me administrator and bureaucrat rights there? Thanks. - ABloom (talk) 00:19, 12 October 2013 (UTC)

Please remove WikiconstitucióCustom logo
Please remove the custom logo at http://wikiconstitucio.orain.org/wiki/Main_Page. (long story, I will submit an image with the approriate size. Being an svg I thought it would scale automatically)--QuimGil (talk) 21:16, 14 October 2013 (UTC)

Oversight please
https://meta.orain.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Tyreek&direction=prev&oldid=2455

Inquisitor Ehrenstein (talk) 01:28, 18 October 2013 (UTC)
 * ✅ John (talk) 10:22, 18 October 2013 (UTC)

SACwiki login problems
Hi John. There is currently a problem logging in to sac.orain.org for all its users, myself included. Each time I log out, I have to reset my password in order to log in. Users who chose not to register their emails in their Preferences are stuck without even this password resetting workaround. Could you please take a look at the problem as a lot of work there is held up. Regards, SAC SEC (talk) 17:00, 23 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Hi, We are currently looking into the problem. John (talk) 17:18, 23 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Thanks. What could be the cause of this glitch? Regards, SAC SEC (talk) 13:48, 24 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Database issues or sessions probably. We fixed a few issues yesterday so if it is still continuing, we'll take another look. John (talk) 13:49, 24 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Unfortunately, the issue does continue for SACwiki users. Like, I can log into meta.orain.org fine, which also logs me into SACwiki, but I cannot access SACwiki directly. Regards, SAC SEC (talk) 16:30, 24 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Three days past, and the problem is still there. Is there anything that can be done about it? Regards, SAC SEC (talk) 11:10, 27 October 2013 (UTC)

Need help reverting a lot of vandal edits to Orain Meta
Some vandal named "Sexy" went on a vandal spree, and while I blocked the vandal and gave myself emergency rollbacker powers to attempt to undo the damage, they shuffled a lot of pages around so I'm not sure where to start, so anyone who can clean stuff up would be appreciated. I also suggest page move rights be restricted to administrators and stewards only on Orain Meta from now on. Arcane (talk) 11:57, 24 October 2013 (UTC)Arcane
 * I'll take a look around the pages. I'll discuss with the others about move permissions. For what it is worth, I dealt with the account globally (locked) and blocked the source (local CU block here and a global IP block), hopefully there should be no further issues. John (talk) 13:10, 24 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Thank you. I figure since this wiki is mainly for coordination of the entire farm, page move permissions should be restricted to prevent obvious abuse, but aside from that, most other vandalism shouldn't be too hard to deal with. Again, thanks for the help, please revert any vandalism I might have missed. Arcane (talk) 13:17, 24 October 2013 (UTC)Arcane

Kidding?

 * At the time, taken as a request. May not have been intentional but, construed. John (talk) 17:26, 26 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Well, you asked me and I answered "I don't care". So in fact it was done by your request, not mine :p eikes (talk) 17:29, 26 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Let me reword to 'Done per *a* request' :p John (talk) 17:29, 26 October 2013 (UTC)

Merged?
Have Orain now officially merged with tropical now? If so, how do I transfer my account?

-Spydar007

Would like to request external wiki page importing rights for importing an Orain friendly version of Twinkle.
The Twinkle gadget from Wikipedia does not work on Orain at present, due to having been customized for Wikipedia. I have found a version of Twinkle on another wiki that will work with little to no modification, and I have also made XML dumps of all the required templates needed for the extension (I may be missing some, but all the essentials should be present for general use).

My problem is that the current import pages right is restricted to interwiki copying, which will not work for importation of this gadget for obvious reasons. I have tested this version of Twinkle on my localhost wiki and found it works "out of the box" with minimal or no modification, and I would like to provide a reasonably functional version of the gadget via Special:Import. Arcane (talk) 03:25, 4 November 2013 (UTC)Arcane
 * ✅ John (talk) 07:41, 4 November 2013 (UTC)
 * I should be done for now. I imported a lot of stuff that Twinkle uses, not entirely confident I got it all (it has a LOT of dependencies and templates it requires, and I do mean a LOT), but most of the general purpose stuff should be in place. This version should work fine if you enable the gadget in your user preferences, but it will need some editing for Orain specific stuff, since this is a crude import of the Wikipedia gadget that was retooled for general use, and if I can make a more complete version, I'll let you know. If you want to rescind my temporary upload rights, please feel free, since I probably won't have a cleaned up version of the Twinkle import ready for a long time. Arcane (talk) 12:10, 4 November 2013 (UTC)Arcane
 * Removed rights. John (talk) 16:00, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

The merge
Have TrpoicalWikis now merged with Orain? If so, have you moved the wikis and accounts over?

-Spydar007


 * Hi Spydar007, please see Forum:Tropical Wikis. Kudu (talk) 21:14, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

Bureaucrat flag on UnWiki
Hello John, I did remove the bureaucrat as a test because I thought that it could be restored due to the lack of an asterisk. Please restore it as I have given you it and unblocked you. Thank you. Kiko4564 (talk) 23:50, 26 November 2013 (UTC)
 * Already done. John (talk) 23:52, 26 November 2013 (UTC)
 * Thanks, once again. :) Kiko4564 (talk) 02:28, 27 November 2013 (UTC)

Question
Hi John, the main page states that Orain has merged with TropicalWikis, however, I cannot find any of the Tropical Wiki wikis and my account doesn't exist. Was there an error and some wikis couldn't be imported? I'd appreciate it if you could answer some of these questions! Thanks!


 * Never mind, I just read Forum:Tropical Wikis.

Hello
Hello John, I would like to know if you guys will have a way wikis on orain can advertise themselves like we need editors. --Tyreek (talk) 04:12, 27 December 2013 (UTC)
 * I believe we may be looking at editor retention and gain on wikis soon. John (talk) 11:58, 27 December 2013 (UTC)

Uploads Disabled
Hello.

It appears that uploads are disabled on this wiki. Is there a way you can enable it? Thanks. --YoshiCraft2011 (talk) 21:58, 4 January 2014 (UTC)
 * ✅ -- Joe G. (Talk) 23:37, 5 January 2014 (UTC)

A favour
Hi John! I have a favour here. Will you grant Shanmugamp7 autopatrol here on Meta Orain? He is a highly trustworthy user (a global sysop on WMF). Thanks.  Jianhui67 talk 18:09, 11 January 2014 (UTC)
 * I know the user. Autopatrol just skipped my mind. John (talk) 22:37, 11 January 2014 (UTC)
 * Thanks Guys :D--Shanmugamp7 (talk) 12:55, 12 January 2014 (UTC)

Wiki request
Hi John, could you please take a look at our wiki request? Moolriaz (talk) 12:57, 20 January 2014 (UTC)

Tada!
Look what I have edited on my wiki! :P Here it is. Tyreek (talk) 23:43, 20 March 2014 (UTC)

I just requested a new wiki
Can you please add both the www and non www versions of the domain that I requested? I set the IP address to 192.184.92.154, is that correct? Dondrekhan (talk) 03:49, 23 March 2014 (UTC)

TropicalWiki Accounts
Question about the TropicalWiki accounts. If you were to create a Orain account with the same name as a TropicalWiki account before they are revived, would it effect anything? I understand it may be a little silly of a question, but I'm just wondering.
 * Nothing will be affected as the TropicalWikis data is unfortunately lost and there is no way for Orain to gain the data to import on our servers. Sorry. John (talk) 17:22, 30 March 2014 (UTC)

Message on your talkpage on TestWiki]
I am just alerting you that you have a new messages from me (Reception123) on your on your talkpage on TestWiki --Reception123 (talk) 18:37, 30 March 2014 (UTC)

Encyclopedia Muricana
Thank you for creating it! Can I have bureaucrat access now?

I also asked for the domains encyclopediamuricana.us and www.encyclopediamuricana.us with the www version as the default.

Can you also set editing to be restricted to registered users?

Dondrekhan (talk) 16:59, 31 March 2014 (UTC)

Question about wiki types
On the form to create a wiki, it says to choose personal, public, or private. What's the difference between private and personal? --Chill57181 (talk) 19:12, 5 April 2014 (UTC)
 * The fact that AFAIK we don't allow personal wikis at the moment. Let me fix that quickly :) John (talk) 19:14, 5 April 2014 (UTC)

Rights
Thanks for creating my wiki. Can you promote me to bureaucrat there? --Chill57181 (talk) 19:02, 5 May 2014 (EDT)
 * Done. John (talk) 19:10, 5 May 2014 (EDT)

Also, I made the wiki as private in my request, but my friend says they can see it. (They don't have any user rights on their account) --Chill57181 (talk) 21:11, 5 May 2014 (EDT)

A cheeseburger for you!

 * Welcome. John (talk) 22:32, 18 May 2014 (BST)

Upload image
Could you enable image uploading on my new wiki, Hidden Treefort? I made a request at Request features but it seems to have been overlooked. Thanks! --Chill57181 (talk) 17:18, 24 May 2014 (BST)

Image glitch
Hi, I've encountered a glitch with images. I can upload them, but if I try and put them on a page it only shows the filename, not the actual image. I don't know if this is a problem on just my wiki (Hidden Treefort), or across the entire Orain. --Chill57181 (talk) 19:09, 28 May 2014 (BST)
 * Hm. This seems to be an issue on a few wikis actually. Investigating... John (talk) 19:14, 28 May 2014 (BST)

Thanks...
...for giving me the autopatrolled and rollbacker flag. Regards, Dragneel (talk) 22:22, 6 June 2014 (BST)
 * Welcome. John (talk) 22:23, 6 June 2014 (BST)

Request features
Hello, plese respond my request feature. Thanks, Dragneel (talk) 22:57, 6 June 2014 (BST)
 * Question: How I can import pages for Wikia to my wiki? Dragneel (talk) 23:01, 6 June 2014 (BST)
 * Do you have an XML file of the pages you want to import and is this a one time thing or something you'll need to do constantly? John (talk) 23:03, 6 June 2014 (BST)
 * I don't understand your question. I only want to import pages to my wiki, but I think I need importer flag. Dragneel (talk) 23:08, 6 June 2014 (BST)
 * Yes, but you also need an XML content dump. Which is why I am asking before I grant the flag. John (talk) 23:09, 6 June 2014 (BST)
 * No, unfortunately I don't have XML files. But no problem, I will contact the founder of the wiki in Wikia to invite here and ask if I can copy/paste articles of their wiki. Regards, Dragneel (talk) 23:13, 6 June 2014 (BST)
 * Alright. John (talk) 23:14, 6 June 2014 (BST)

Well...
You should have mentioned Orain.kr on Site update! xD &mdash; ReviComplaint?  10:15, 13 June 2014 (BST)
 * Meh :p John (talk) 16:02, 13 June 2014 (BST)

Links in message notification email are wrong
Hello. Thanks for the site update! It's nice to hear that things are progressing. :-) One little bug I had was the email I got alerting me to your message:

OrainMessenger left a message on your talk page:

View message: 

View changes: 

--

To control which emails we send you, check your preferences: https://meta.orain.org/wiki/Special:Preferences#mw-prefsection-echo

Which obviously shouldn't have localhost URLs. :-)

—Samwilson (talk) 02:56, 14 June 2014 (BST)
 * Joyful. I guess we don't have a major MediaWiki setting set. I'll take a look later. John (talk) 07:30, 14 June 2014 (BST)

Tracked on github. &mdash; ReviComplaint?  12:45, 14 June 2014 (BST)


 * Thanks! :) Samwilson (talk) 02:15, 15 June 2014 (BST)

127.0.0.1
Sorry. I forgot about the sysadmins. I was thinking from external point of view.— cyberpower ChatOnline 13:34, 14 June 2014 (BST)

Barnstar
I'd like to give you a barnstar for all the work you do here on Orain and elsewhere! Southparkfan (talk) 19:56, 22 June 2014 (BST)
 * Thanks John (talk) 19:58, 22 June 2014 (BST)

Image glitch followup
A while ago I reported a glitch involving images on Orain, but I'm still having the problem on my wiki a month later. I don't mean to sound rude or impatient, but how is progress on fixing this coming along? --Chill57181 (talk) 02:11, 1 July 2014 (BST)

CreateWiki founder issues
It seems it doesn't care whether the account is globally created or not. I did a test:  and I got the same founder error. Southparkfan (talk) 01:33, 6 July 2014 (BST)
 * I'll look in the logs when I get back then. John (talk) 08:50, 6 July 2014 (BST)
 * Until this issue is solved, someone should get access to createLocalAccount.php and a $wgAddGroups hack for userrights-interwiki I think. Southparkfan (talk) 13:03, 6 July 2014 (BST)
 * The issue is it can create the account with the maintenance script before the wiki is loaded. And a addgroup hack for userright interwiki requires modification to MediaWiki itself, modifications I don't want to make. John (talk) 13:31, 6 July 2014 (BST)
 * Hm, strange. Something like a delay or whatever should be enabled Southparkfan (talk) 13:41, 6 July 2014 (BST)
 * It's the way Orain is set up really. I'm going to work on an 'enable-able' hack for CreateWiki to overcome this which will be enabled on Orain but disable in the extension. John (talk) 13:43, 6 July 2014 (BST)

Delete Techwritewiki
(Logboek nieuwe wiki's); 21:36. . Southparkfan (Overleg | bijdragen) maakte de wiki "Techwritewiki" aan met "Mikmik" als oprichter ‎(Wiki created per request of Mikmik) had an uppercase letter in error. Please delete the database. Southparkfan (talk) 20:37, 7 July 2014 (BST)
 * And please create User:Mikmik on the wiki (and migrate it ofc) and assign it's rights :) Southparkfan (talk) 20:39, 7 July 2014 (BST)
 * mysql -p -e "drop database Techwritewiki" John (talk) 15:46, 8 July 2014 (BST)

Image glitch followup
A while ago I reported a glitch involving images on Orain, but I'm still having the problem on my wiki a month later. I don't mean to sound rude or impatient, but how is progress on fixing this coming along? --Chill57181 (talk) 18:35, 8 July 2014 (BST)
 * We've investigated and can't seem to find any cause of the issues. Images seems to be working fine for me on my end now. John (talk) 18:36, 8 July 2014 (BST)
 * ✅. Apply the fix to the servers now. John (talk) 16:22, 21 July 2014 (BST)

Error

 * Hi,my wiki worldnews.orain.org 開不出來，How can I do?--Msnhinet8 (talk) 14:43, 14 July 2014 (BST)
 * What do you mean? How to edit, create pages, etc? Southparkfan (talk) 14:44, 14 July 2014 (BST)
 * I do not come out open wiki yeah, tell me how to do?--Msnhinet8 (talk) 14:46, 14 July 2014 (BST)
 * I can little English .--Msnhinet8 (talk) 14:46, 14 July 2014 (BST)
 * At https://worldnews.orain.org/wiki/%E9%A6%96%E9%A0%81, use the search function at the right side (http://gyazo.com/9b10f5914c949667acf0ce8dd99e5fa3), at the top. If you want to create a page called "test", type there just "test". That page doesn't exists yet, so you read "於此wiki建立這個頁面「Test」！請參見已發現之0條搜尋結果. ". Click on "test" there. Put in the big box some content, and click on "儲存頁面". Hope I helped you :). Southparkfan (talk) 14:50, 14 July 2014 (BST)


 * I just hope I come out of it open wiki.--Msnhinet8 (talk) 14:52, 14 July 2014 (BST)
 * So,what this?how should I open my wiki?--Msnhinet8 (talk) 14:54, 14 July 2014 (BST)
 * Your wiki is available at worldnews.orain.org. Southparkfan (talk) 14:55, 14 July 2014 (BST)


 * this https://meta.orain.org/wiki/User_talk:John .--Msnhinet8 (talk) 14:56, 14 July 2014 (BST)
 * How can I do?you can help me?我一直打不開這個維基. --Msnhinet8 (talk) 14:56, 14 July 2014 (BST)
 * 有了，我開起來了，orain meta is very good.--Msnhinet8 (talk) 15:27, 14 July 2014 (BST)

Rename db/wiki
I guess https://tech.orain.org/wiki/Renaming_a_database and https://tech.orain.org/wiki/Rename_wiki are the same. Can you merge them? Southparkfan (talk) 14:45, 14 July 2014 (BST)
 * Separate for a reason. The first is specific to a single database while the latter is for renaming an existing wiki which is referenced from other databases. While the same in theory; the latter contains some SQL code I want to keep aspartame to reduce confusion. John (talk) 14:55, 14 July 2014 (BST)

Problème avec un wiki
Bonjour john, J'ai fais une demande de wiki,mais il n'a pas été créer. Pourriez vous le créer ?

--Bastenbas (talk) 18:16, 28 July 2014 (BST)
 * ✅ - Sorry for the delay. Let us know if you need something. Southparkfan (talk) 18:23, 28 July 2014 (BST)

Wiki creation
I just got another founder error. I did what the list said and waited less than a minute before creating the wiki. There has to be some trick that I'm missing. I there a way I can create a practice wiki until I figure it out? Lieutenant S., Geschichtsmeister des Lexipedium (talk) 19:18, 3 August 2014 (BST)
 * The wording is probably not the best. It means wait until the minute rolls over. Here you added it to the list at :15, you need to wait until :16 to create the wiki. John (talk) 19:19, 3 August 2014 (BST)

Protective programs
I was talking to Arcane about developing useful programs that could be used to monitor and address vandals or various other weirdos.

We were discussing this one script and he asked if there was a way that I could make it beneficial for Orain. He said there were some issues with people from WMF trying to cause trouble because of problems there.

This one checks for certain trigger words in discussions that could indicate harassment or some other improper activities.

https://github.com/KrasnayaSecurity/WikiDefenseSuite/blob/master/web_scanners/saloon_bar.py

Lieutenant S., Geschichtsmeister des Lexipedium (talk) 19:23, 7 August 2014 (BST)
 * Given how a few idiots from WMF projects who were banned or otherwise disciplined there by some staff here refused to accept this and tried to start nonsense here, LS has retooled a python script that will act as a tripwire for whenever certain things are mentioned in a post about a certain user, which should be useful in keeping track of death threats or threats of bodily or other sorts of harm as well as libel or other criminal mischief. It can also be used to detect patterns of vandalism so it can be dealt with more efficiently. Arcane (talk) 21:28, 7 August 2014 (BST)
 * I think a global sysop bot would be better for dealing with vandalism. This script could probably detect obscenities used in vandalism, but would be more useful for detecting hostile talk.  A web crawler for talk pages would be better for WMF.  Lieutenant S., Geschichtsmeister des Lexipedium (talk) 21:36, 7 August 2014 (BST)
 * I've got a program here: https://github.com/KrasnayaSecurity/WikiDefenseSuite/blob/master/web_scanners/WMF_scan.py Lieutenant S., Geschichtsmeister des Lexipedium (talk) 22:25, 7 August 2014 (BST)
 * I oppose to GSBot. Its false positive will be pain in the ass. &mdash; ReviComplaint?  11:10, 8 August 2014 (BST)
 * We can just use the scanners then. Lieutenant S., Geschichtsmeister des Lexipedium (talk) 14:32, 8 August 2014 (BST)
 * Just writing here I have acknowledge the comments here. I will get around to writing a response later tonight to tomorrow. John (talk)

Abuse!
Hi John! I heard that some abuse has been done here lately. Could you investigate? --Stryn (talk) 21:15, 8 August 2014 (BST)
 * Ha :p John (talk) 21:16, 8 August 2014 (BST)